Not getting into the politics of the whole situation, but I found this funny.

[UTE98]

At this point, it feels like the Ravens are almost trolling Kaepernick here. 

 

breaking-ravens-sign-former-49ers-quarterback

 

 

[UtMtBiker]

Politics aside, Kaep was so incredibly stupid in this whole thing. Used the platform that he was giving as a pro athlete in a terrible way. Now, he has no platform to spread his message because of how he approached this. He severely over estimated his value as a mediocre QB and now is paying the price. Should have used his celebrity in way others have and he would still have a job AND a platform to spread his message. You have to be really good, like all pro good, to p**s that many people off and keep your job in any industry.

[Utah]

I don’t get why we care so much about this. When did standing at attention with a hand on our hearts become such a big deal? 

Do you honestly think someone who sits there hates America? Maybe they are tired. Or drunk. Or think some ritual before a game is dumb. 

Think about it. How dumb is the national anthem? 50,000 people staring blankly at a flag while a song plays before a game? What’s the difference between that and a prayer? Seems cultish to me. 

[GameForAnyFuss]

In most other countries, the national anthem isn’t sung before sporting events. And in the South American country where I grew up, most people don’t know the national anthem (although being 8 minutes long doesn’t help either).

I’m not offering an opinion one way or the other, but singing the anthem at sporting events, and having the national anthem be in the collective consciousness of the population in general, seems to be a mostly American cultural tradition.

[Utah]

Yup. I don’t understand the outrage. 

[Puget Ute]

Kaepernick does a TON of charity work and donates significant time and energy into projects and camps that help sick kids, for example.

He took a knee as a simple, quiet protest, expressly because he had a platform to get out the message that people today are NOT treated equally. He used his platform to protest for those who get marginalized or physically attacked when they protest the same thing. All that anybody wants is to be treated with the same respect as everybody else.

And particularly after the ludicrous torchlight parade in Charlottesville last weekend, I know we will see a significant number of players doing exactly the same thing this season.

[Tony (admin)]

Personally it turned me off and I’m one of the ones who stopped watching the NFL. I consider doing that disrespectful. Yeah this country is a horrible place that allowed him the opportunity to make millions. He has a right to do what he wants and stand up for whatever causes he wants, sure. And he must weigh his choices and how they impact himself and the public, as a high profile person.

The thing I have a problem with is the spreading of hate for the police who for the most part do us all a great service at great risk for little pay. Yes there are some bad cops, but the percentage of bad cops vs good cops is huge. Far more white people are killed by cops every year than black people, but nobody cares about that. Black murders are mostly black on black, and nobody seems to care about that either.

Seems to me he is helping create an atmosphere of hate and fear, which might even cause some of the violence he’s protesting against.

[SkinyUte]

“Far more white people are killed by cops every year than black people, but nobody cares about that.”

In total, sure. Compared to the overall population size for each group? Not even remotely close.

Black people are somewhere between 3X to 9X more likely to be killed by police, depending on which study you read.

[Tony (admin)]

What’s the percentage of crimes committed compared to the overall population between blacks and whites? I don’t know but that would be interesting to find out.

[SkinyUte]

Without getting too far down the rabbit hole of socio-economic factors and being careful not to dig too far into politics (which I’ve sworn to do a better job of avoiding), here’s a few comparative crime statistics for minorities (from 2015).

One that addresses your specific question:

African Americans and whites use drugs at similar rates, but the imprisonment rate of African Americans for drug charges is almost 6 times that of whites.

[Chidojuan]

Honest question, can you clarify this data for me? Does using at similar rates mean population percentages? Or total users? And where does this data come from? Arrests? Self reporting? Rehab centers? Are the imprisonment rates solely for drug charges, or for charges in addition to drug charges. Honestly wondering, not trying to get political or start an internet fight.

[SkinyUte]

Like most things online, it’s an overly simplified statement for the purposes of a bullet-point list. That said, here’s a 2016 WaPo report with similar findings that lists all their sources (i.e. it’s not an opinion or editorial piece). I haven’t had time to dig into them today, but a quick glance appears to be legit.

A number of key statistics (and their sources) can be found here.

This article says basically the same thing as well. Yes, it’s HuffPo (which I typically disregard entirely), but the article links directly to the actual studies that the data is pulled from.

Anecdotally, I’ve heard similar figures repeated quite often with the law enforcement and corrections agencies I work with. Take that for whatever it’s worth (i.e. very little).

[Chidojuan]

Thanks for the reply SkinyUte, and the sources.  They were really insightful, especially the Post article.  What I’m gathering is that while the use and dealing is similar, Black Americans get caught a lot more that White Americans.  I’m not really sure what to make of that.  Probably the answer is somewhere in the middle between drug decriminalization, and a complete revamp of police policy and strategy.  I’m not qualified to make the call.  At any rate, thanks again for the sources, and hopefully I didn’t make you feel attacked.  Ute fans have to stand together.

[SkinyUte]

No worries, I’m a grizzled veteran of the Utah fan site political wars. And I’m very guilty of dishing out my own attacks, although I’m trying to be better about that around these parts. 🙂 I actually wish more discussions ended up like this, with actual data presentation and analysis.

I agree that any potential solution is very cloudy and difficult to determine. I think a lot of it can be simply attributed to demographics within specific areas (i.e. greater police presence in primarily minority areas = more arrests), but that doesn’t really provide many answers and speaks more to the broader socio-economic conditions that create that scenario. Like you, I don’t have any answers, but feel that overbroad generalizations (i.e. police kill more whites than blacks, ergo there’s not a problem) don’t help to promote the discussion.

Back to the original topic, I really think that Kapernick’s situation has far more to do with him being a gimmicky, mediocre QB than any of his other antics. If teams felt he could actually help them, I have no doubt he’d be brought in.

I don’t much care about his protests one way or the other. He seems like a decent enough guy (judging by the huge amount of charity work he does), and if he wants to protest by kneeling during the anthem, I’ve got no problem with that. It’s not hurting anyone, and the whole “YOU’RE DISRESPECTING ‘MURICA” thing seems absurdly overblown. He’s doing something quintessentially American, which is exercising his first amendment rights.