Oregon State, Washington State Will Expand to the Big 12 Or ESPN Loses $320 Mill

[The Miami Ute]

Pretty interesting interview. Summary is as follows: As long as the PAC remains an active P5 conference, it will receive $320M per year from ESPN as part of the CFP payout. That money will be split solely between OSU and Wazzu. The committee that has the power to change a conference’s “P” status is chaired by Kirk Schulz, the Wazzu president, and requires an unanimous vote to strip a conference of its “P” status (meaning it would never happen under his watch). OSU and Wazzu could play a full football schedule as P5s by using a fraction of that large payout to pay mid-majors to play them home and away indefinitely. As a consequence, it behooves the rest of the college football world to get both OSU and Wazzu in another P5 conference, otherwise those two schools will receive, by far, more football-related funding than any other school in the NCAA.

Oregon State, Washington State Will Expand to the Big 12 Or ESPN Loses $320 Million

[NarfUte]

That’s a fun narrative but the missing point is if the Pac-2 doesn’t have at least 7 members by 2025 (unless the NCAA grants some sort of waiver) it will no longer be an NCAA multisport conference and loses the designation regardless.

[The Miami Ute]

Is that by the beginning of 2025 or at the end of 2025? Nevertheless, I’m pretty certain no one wants OSU or Wazzu to get in that one year what it’s going to take Utah five years as part of the Big 12.

[alexsmith]

This might not be 100% accurate. The CFP is different from the NCAA and has different standards of a conference

[The Miami Ute]

That might be the case, I don’t know. What I do know is that in the world of contracts and litigation, it’s really difficult to change things in a short period of time and without consensus. I’d keep an eye on this issue because I have a feeling that it has the potential to move front and center in a short period of time.

[PhiladelphiaUte]

We should invite Wazzu and Ore St one day after the Pac-12 folds. That way, they’ll be sole owner of the PACN, and can negotiate their entrance into the Big 12 by bringing it with them. We can then rebrand it, and lease it to ESPN — like we should have done all along, and the SECN had always done.

And for anyone who thinks “no way, the PACN sucked”, let it be known that it’ll serve as another platform for exposure that wouldn’t be any worse the ESPN+.

[Utah]

Here is what will happen. ESPN won’t pay. OSU and WSU will sue. ESPN will argue that they paid for USC, not WSU and OSU and WSU are acting in bad faith. The judge will roll their eyes and tell them to figure it out.

ESPN will then settle with OSU and WSU…either with cash or get them into a conference.

It’s no different than the Texas/OU stuff. Texas and OU aren’t losing any money leaving the Big 12. Utah and ASU and Colorado and Arizona aren’t losing any money going to the Big 12. When it comes to long term relationships…it’s a lot easier to just give money away than fight things.

The problem WSU and OSU has is…no one cares. If they go to another conference or not…no one cares. So ESPN will do some deal with them…cash, take on their debt, whatever, just to get them to go away.

The other problem OSU and WSU have is that no one has left the PAC-12 yet…outside of USC and UCLA. So technically, WSU and OSU can’t do anything without the other P10 member agreeing. And the P10 members can agree to do a lot of s**tty things to OSU and WSU.

It’s fascinating to watch.

[DataUte]

Expand on this: “no one has left the PAC-12 yet…outside of USC and UCLA” – what do you mean?

CU has been given the letter saying they have no vote. And with the acceptance into Big 10 (UO, UW) and Big 12 (UA, ASU, Utah), are you saying they ‘haven’t left’ just because they are playing this year in the PAC12 and not officially in the new conference until 2024 (btw, all sports, not just football even if that’s what is driving it all)? I think that’s the whole lawsuit from OSU/WSU – once you announce you are leaving, you lose your vote (as per the letters already served USC, UCLA, CU) – their argument is that all the others should be in the same boat.

[Utah]

Technically, I think only USC, UCLA and Colorado have formally told the P12 they are leaving.

The other teams are still full members…and at least on paper…long term members of the PAC-12. They’d be stupid to leave right now. There are too many things to figure out. They all invested in the PAC-12 Networks. They need to figure out who owns that and how it will be broken up. They have money tied up in the playoffs. And NCAA’s.

To think that they would walk away and give OSU and WSU 320 million…it’s silly. Now, OSU and WSU are trying to argue that Utah, Oregon, UW, etc shouldn’t be allowed to vote anymore because it looks like they might leave…is just as silly.

It’s all posturing right now. There is a lot of money and value in the PAC-12…we don’t even know if OSU and WSU will even be allowed to call themselves the “PAC-anything” yet.

This is a longs ways from being over and OSU and WSU will not come out of this looking like a winner. They lost and lost big time and they are desperately trying to grasp onto anything that makes them look ok.

[2008 National Champ]

Wouldn’t you if you were in WSU and OSU’s place?

The injunction was so that the schools that were leaving could not use their majority to disband the conference and splits the assets in their favor. Two of the items on the agenda were (1) for Kliavkoff and his staff to get golden parachutes and (2) to allow the schools that were leaving to take larger shares of the conference’s assets so that they could offset the anticipated future travel costs.

That is almost Stalinesque in its ruthlessness.

[Central Coast Ute]

Pretty sure Colorado already signed with the B12 and received a signing bonus to do it.

[Utah]

Then Colorado is dumb as rocks. “let’s give up voting rights on issues valuing 500 million dollars for 2 million dollars…”

Morons.

[The Miami Ute]

You’re correct. No one has left yet. However, we’re talking about 2024 and onwards, when the PAC will consist solely of OSU and Wazzu. Obviously, I haven’t read the fine print on the contract but it really sounds to me like OSU and Wazzu have ESPN by the cujones on this issue. Yes, ESPN could try to go to court and say that the terms of the contract have changed and that might be true. However, if the wording of the contract disseminating these funds doesn’t stipulate as to the size and composition of the receiving conference, what can ESPN do but pay up?

[Utah]

It will be interesting to watch. No on in a million years thought the PAC-12 would go away. And hell, if Colorado doesn’t sell out for 2 million…it might still be here.

I bet there isn’t even dissolution terms in the contracts, that’s how crazy all this is. Who would have ever imagined USC would bail and go be Ohio State, and Michigan and Penn St’s bitch when they could stay in So Cal and be the King? Crazy.

Step 1 will be determining who can vote on issues. WSU and OSU will argue that the 4 corners and Cali schools are leaving and shouldn’t be allowed to vote. Those schools will argue that they haven’t left and should be allowed to vote. And they should. They all sacrificed money to build up the P12 Networks. And OSU and WSU have been P5 members for decades and decades and haven’t ever done s**t. They don’t deserve anything.

I bet we see something similar to what happened to Texas and OU and the Big 12. Texas and OU got all their money, the remaining Big 12 schools got screwed and everyone forgot about it.

I could see the P12 Network being sold off, the money split 12 or 13 ways, the 300 million being distributed to the new conferences (ACC, B1G, and Big 12) and maybe OSU and WSU joining the Big 12 or MWC and getting next to nothing. And why should they?

USC and Oregon and UW and Stanford and Cal and UCLA carried them for decades. Then Utah came in and carried them. They aren’t good at football. They aren’t good at basketball. They aren’t good at academics. They were just lucky enough to be there.

Their biggest issue is they waited too long. Had they raided the Big 12, the Pac would still exist. Had they all left and joined the Big 12 before the G5 schools did, the G5 schools would be screwed and OSU and WSU would be in. But none of that happened and here we are. Sucks to be OSU and WSU. My recommendation: Stop sucking at everything.

[The Miami Ute]

I don’t necessarily disagree with your post. However, the caveat I add is that the only schools left in the PAC when the CFP money is divvied out after the 2024 season will be OSU and Wazzu. That being the case, there’s no legal ground for Utah or any other former PAC school to request a share of that payout. Unless there’s language in the contract stipulating otherwise, it’ll belong solely to the OSU and Wazzu.

[Utah]

Unless the PAC modifies the contract with the remaining voting members. That is key to all of this. Who is allowed to vote?

Because right now, you have 8 members of the PAC who haven’t left.

[The Miami Ute]

This is going down the rabbit hole because we don’t even know if that type of vote would be based purely on a majority or an unanimous vote. I also don’t know if it’s even legally possible to amend a contract of that type because it would probably affect the other conferences as well.

[2008 National Champ]

San Diego State tried the “we really didn’t mean we were leaving when we announced we were leaving” argument and it cost them 17 MM.

The grant of rights expires on August 1, 2024 and so does the current PAC-12 agreement. Anything after that would have required a new grant of rights. There aren’t any “contracts” that extend past that date which is why all of the schools are able to leave without penalty.

Until the injunction is lifted or it is decided that only WSU/OSU have voting rights, it is at an impasse. If I’m WSU/OSU I’ve already got (1) termination papers written up for commissioner and staff, (2) a schedule based on the 9 remaining teams, (3) a new grant of rights, and (4) a new commissioner that answers only to them ready to be installed. If the judge rules in their favor, they then have all the leverage to force the other schools to formally withdraw while relinquishing any claim on the PAC name or it’s assets.

All 7 schools sent out press releases stating that they had accepted invitations to join their new conferences. It’s going to be pretty tough to argue that they haven’t formally withdrawn. Actually, I take that back. I’m not sure if Stanford and California have made statements yet that they are joining the ACC so maybe it’s just the 5 (UW, Oregon, Utah, Arizona, ASU) that are in that quandry.

[The Miami Ute]

UC Berkeley To Join ACC For 2024-25 Academic Year

Stanford to Join the Atlantic Coast Conference in August 2024

[2008 National Champ]

I was pretty sure that they had but figured I’d better do a little cya. Thanks for the backup

[LOhunter]

Not a fan of either team, but support Oregon State and Washington State doing anything they can to put pressure on the NCAA, ESPN, other power conferences and the other 10 current member schools of the PAC 12, to get into the Big 12 or some other Power 4 conference. Just stinks that after more than 100 years of existence, the so called smart guys running the conference and the school Presidents did not have the foresight/wisdom to protect the conference from this.

[bombastic]

There is no way that WSU and OSU keep the assets they haven’t earned. The assets owned by PAC-12 belong to 12 schools (including USC and UCLA). I don’t know the legal elements behind but I just don’t see OSU and WSU coming on top. Too much money on the table.