Rose Bowl and Omicron Variant

[cicampbe]

Anyone else worried that California is going to shut down and the Rose Bowl will be closed to fans? I’m definitely concerned.

[fosternano]

I don’t think California can afford to go into lockdown again. There was a special election to remove Gov Newsom from office (granted it failed easily) with how he mishandled it.

[MauchDawgUte]

You have to provide a negative test or be vaccinated to attend. If they were going to cancel it or not allow fans it would have been done already. So much money to lose out on by canceling. I don’t see it happening.

[UtahUtesRock]

Per Josh Newman, he’s checked into it and it sounds like it wouldn’t happen. 

[cicampbe]

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but California has gone on complete lockdown (with full travel ban) at least twice before. Politics aside, as there are good arguments on both sides of shutting down. Also, from what I’ve read, this variant is supposed to peak around Jan 9th. There are real reasons to think that fans won’t be allowed at the Rose Bowl.

[cicampbe]

I found this recent quote from Gavin Newsom that is promising….

“There’s more panic than information around this variant. Doubling down on what we’re doing is the most important message. We can avoid shutting down our schools or businesses. None of us want to see that happen. I don’t want to see that happen. And I see no indication at this moment whatsoever that that’s in our immediate future.”

[Utesbyfive]

Exactly correct. As of now, they’re not seeing big jumps in hospitalizations from Omicron, and that’s always their bellwether as to when to even consider lockdowns.

[Duhwayne]

Omicron accounted for 2.9% of American cases nine days ago. It is 73% nationwide and 90% of cases in New York. The R is expected to be higher in than March 2020 and peak the second week of January. This in a population that is mostly vaxxed. That is bad news and good news. Info about severity is still TBD but if severity is declining and this flashes through the country there is a chance we are approaching the late stages of the pandemic. As I understand it (and I am not a scientist) this course of mutation is kind of how pandemics reach their end. Not sure what the Rose Bowl will do but I think the biggest threat to the game is if the teams start to see infections. Cross fingers on that first. These are 20 year olds we’re talking about. Fwiw Cornell, Princeton and Harvard have all gone remote again.

[Central Coast Ute]

I wouldn’t expect that to happen until after the first of the year, if at all.

[Italy88]

Yeah, there isn’t a good reason to shut down again. Politicians love fear and the power it gives them.

[dystopiamembrane]

An anarchist in your midst…

[PlainsUte]

Our best way to predict what will happen here is to look at what happened in South Africa where Omicron first took off.   It took about 3 weeks to get to what appears to be the peak in new cases per day.   Doctors report the symptoms are very mild, especially for those who are vaccinated – 3-4 days with cold-like symptoms.   Not sure the impact on hospitalizations, but the graph of deaths does not have any sort of descernable up-tick.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/south-africa/

Its a bit earlier in the game for Great Britain, and Omicron seems to have hit before Delta had waned there, but here are their stats, again, no real up-tick in deaths discernable so far:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/

The US is more lawsuit adverse so more people may end up hospitalized as CYA.  That shoud also keep death stats from ramping too much.   Problem for the bowl games is that the COVID protocols and policies are based on positive tests and not on severity of symptoms so an uptick in COVID among the players could threaten bowl games everywhere in the next 2 weeks.

[Johnny]

If California shuts things down with the data we have now, I predict a huge uprising and mayhem. 

The NFL already scrambling to ease their current restrictions, because they are now starting to see they absolutely don’t make sense. 

People get sick. Every time at this time of the year. If I didn’t test positive 2 times out of 8(asymptomatic), I’d sing a different tune.

I’m high risk, vaccinated and thankful the lung and heart doctors I’m still accessable to. A year ago I was worried, especially testing positive twice.

Not worried at all anymore. It’s getting almost absurd what’s being conveyed through the media. They feed off of fear. Tune it all out man.

 

[Utesbyfive]

Once I finally got the jab, I decided to just go out and live life. Living in fear of this is unsustainable. If I get it, I get it. I hope it won’t lay me out. Go Utes!!

[Italy88]

Exactly. Fully vaxed and I’m done with masks. It’s never going away and one side of the aisle wants it that way.

[beaslad]

People are downvoting this?

[Utesbyfive]

There’s always going to be scolds who think it’s not good enough. The media has been stoking fear so hard since this started, it’s a wonder people aren’t being dragged from their homes by the mob for not wearing a mask to screw their spouse.

What it really is, is the people who are still terrified, are resentful that anyone would try to resume being normal and happy. Misery loves company.

[Johnny]

No, the “like” and “dislike” needs to die. It’s obvious 99% of message board geeks don’t know anything they’re talking about and seeking validation.

Almost all the stuff here is opinion. I happen to have bad lungs. And a lot of Doctor’s monitoring me for 4 years now. I’ve learned a lot from these folks the last year and a half. 

90% fear, almost zero percent people who knows anything. The fear has made my life very difficult this last year.

However, I will restate, I’m not scared. I can die from pneumonia easily. Covid is now an overblown fear mongering crock of s**t for vaccinated people at this point.

Whether it be big pharm, media or government, we must stop buying into the fear or it will never end and chaos will break out. GLOBALLY

[dystopiamembrane]

Whether it be big pharm, media or government…

Why does everyone forget the lizard people?

[dystopiamembrane]

…I predict a huge uprising and mayhem.

The People’s Front of Judea

[UteManX]

The way teams are getting players with Covid, I’d fear more for our Utes players or osu players getting it than the game being cancelled. Fingers crossed everyone is doing all they can to avoid it yet still prepare.

[Johnny]

Good lord, you fear for their lives? Or fear they can’t play. Come on now. Do the research of what’s happening man. Hell, the NFL about to shut down their protocols because it’s absolutely ridiculous.

Challenge me, Doctor. I have some of the best pulmonary people in the USA monitoring my health for 4 years now. You people living in fear are making things very difficult for me. FFS 

I want to see an argument. Besides knowing someone who died. Bring it, I’m waiting.

[Central Coast Ute]

I took what UtemanX said as he’s afraid the players will test positive and be unable to play, not that he was afraid for their lives.

[Charlie]

There is little definition to determine ‘dying with COVID’ or ‘dying because of COVID’. I believe it is up to each individual doctor to decide. Could both be lumped together into the second category? Sometime ago I saw a discussion between two doctors related to an individual that had no symptoms but had a heart attack and was rushed to the hospital. While being admitted, he was tested positive for COVID and died shortly after arrival. One doctor stated that without COVID the individual could well have survived the heart attack. The other doctor countered, without the heart attack the individual could well have survived COVID. In the beginning, I understood that COVID kills by taking an individual into a cytokine storm and shutting down organs. Could it be that it can kill without any symptoms developing? I really don’t know I just wish someone would figure it all out.

At this point I had my shingles shot and now I do not think about shingles. I have had 3 COVID shots, I would like to think I do not have to think about COVID. At some point before COVID is completely gone we will need to think about it less but that will be an individual choice.

[UrbanLiar]

OK Johnny. I’m not currently living in fear BTW. I’m typing this on a vacation in Maui, so I’m obviously personally comfortable with reasonable precautions. But we as a society need to remember that the strain on the current healthcare professionals is taking a dramatic and negative toll on innocent but susceptible people. We’ve had a significant increase in other serious seasonal hospital admissions such as RSV and the flu is starting to absorb capacity in ICU’s. Hospitals have recently started to delay other medical treatments due to staffing and resource shortages. If a self absorbed Covid commando creates a cascade of infections that tie up healthcare capacity, that’s where I have a problem, and that’s where we as a society have a problem. I don’t support closing everything down again, but we need to be smart in our plans for managing infections as a society, because hospital professionals and infrastructure don’t magically increase overnight. Did I “bring it” enough for you?

[Utesbyfive]

The media’s numbers where they say “90% of ICU beds are full!” Well, honestly that’s probably par for the course, even without Covid. Hospitals like to keep beds full, just like restaurants like to keep tables full. It’s a similar profit motive. My wife was just laid off, as the manager of front line health care workers, not because of problems with the system, not because of Covid in any way, but because Steward Health care is cutting staff to make the bottom line look good before HCA takes over. Then when HCA comes in and realizes that the hospital isn’t functioning efficiently because a lot of managers have been cut, they’ll have to add staff back. Nothing’s changed except mainly the rhetoric. Everything is still all about the money. When the media spews numbers without context they can make anything sound frightening. Meanwhile my family takes a 70% pay cut, and there’s one less person fighting the fight. I can tell you the people left are angry and scrambling to figure out how to compensate for people who were working 50 hour weeks trying to hold things together, who just evaporated from their work force.

I’m just cynical about the whole damn thing at this point. If it was such a major crisis, hospitals wouldn’t be firing people left and right.

[Utesbyfive]

Thanks for downvoting my life going to hell. FU.

[dystopiamembrane]

I hope everything gets better for you and your family. Life in the 1st world can be difficult.

[Utesbyfive]

Hell, I guess is an exaggeration, but how would you feel if your income were slashed that much? It’s gonna suck for quite a while. Oh, and I’m having my hip replaced in two weeks at the hospital that just fired the Mrs. 😤

[dystopiamembrane]

I make minimum wage at a part-time job. Wage slavery sucks.

[Stone]

Wage slavery? What do you mean by that? Slavery implies no choice and no pay whatsoever. 

[dystopiamembrane]

If only there was somewhere we could inquire about a topic and receive answers in an instant.

[Charlie]

Sadly in the M&A world, that includes lots of health care companies, businesses do strange things to look attractive to others like cut costs. Middle management and long term supervisors often get cut because it often takes time for the impact to show up. This expertise is greatly needed for irregular upsets and to train newer staff but fot the short term they simply get by. Next it can be new owners that were convinced they can operate for less, see the difficulty but stick to the plan they sold to others. Businesses have the freedom to make bonehead moves and if you are around long enough you will see some. Thankfully, there are others out there looking to hire the mistakes of others. I hope very soon your wife finds an opportunity that is better then the one she left. Experience gained by thoughtful people that can make improvements is very valuable – more to some than to others. Take care my friend and make sure she believes in herself.

[Utesbyfive]

My wife’s staff is devastated. She was really the glue holding two different departments together with her experience in the specific type of nursing she oversees, and dedicated leadership. Her bosses are beside themselves because now they have to do her 50h/wk job in addition to their own. There are literally nurses in her department that had better opportunities, but stayed because of her. I hope they have an exodus and suffer. I really do. Sadly that means poorer patient care, but oh well, that’s on them. I’d avoid Steward hospitals in Utah for a while.

F Steward.

[UteManX]

Alright Johnny, take a break from the bender. Read what I said, take a moment to process. I’m not fearing for anyone on the teams life, as central coast said, I’d worry more about players testing positive and being forced to sit out, even if they feel totally fine. From my small bit of a connection to the university, there are currently some cases, so let’s hope they don’t spread or are out of the way before the game. 

[Utah5410]

@urbanliar….. hmm pretty sure I’ve heard this before. If that’s the case maybe we should stop firing all the doctors and nurses who refuse to get the jab. Then we wouldn’t be so overwhelmed would we ? I agree with almost everyone here once I got the Jan I moved on with my life. Stop watching MSNBC and CNN Fox News and actually look at studies. Omicron is more transmissible but not deadly thus far. This is now the new flu meaning it will be around every year and we just need go live with it.

[Utesbyfive]

My wife got the vax. She’s being fired anyway. Hospitals are not overwhelmed, at least here in Utah.

[DrJazzy]

I can only speak for the U Hospital – but it is the biggest hospital in the state. We have been on the verge of being ‘overwhelmed’ or actually pverwhelmed (could not accept any hospital transfers like we normally would due to lack of beds) for most of the pandemic. Currently, new policy in place where other ICU servicies (surgical ICU, cardiac ICU, neuro ICU, etc) are having to cover covid patients to help out the medical ICU and residents from other services that aren’t really trained to take care of covid patients (like surgical specialties) continue to be pulled to cover the covid unit to help out. 

The sickest of covid patients, the ICU ones, the split continues to be about 90% UNVACCINATED and 10% vaccinated (might be closer to 85%\15% now that the numbers cont to rise). 

I actually believe in people’s rights to do what they want with their bodies – I am anti-mandates. But based on the data it was an easy decision for me – even though I an fairly certain I was infected early on.

[DrJazzy]

One big difference this yr vs last – people were afraid to come to hospital due to covid. So all the MI/stroke/etc type patients stayed home and either died at home or had acute cardiovascular syndromes and had bad consequences for not coming in acutely. This yr – we get all the usual reasons why one would come to the ED along with the covid patients on top. Pretty easy to overwhelm an entire hospital system. 

And the covid unit sucks. It’s people who have been in the hospital with consequences of covid for weeks to months. They all look like zombies – and a lot are just waiting to die. 

[Utesbyfive]

Can you say that Omicron has slammed your facility any more than it already has been? I don’t want to be rude, but people die. The number of your days is known only to God. People these days will not tolerate disease and death, because they think that modern medicine should be able to fix anything.

Not very long ago, we had diseases like Smallpox, Polio, Typhus, Disentery, Cholera, Erysepilas, Sepsis… Stuff that killed people in droves and there was nothing they could do about it, until antibiotics and sterilizing immunizations came along.

The “vaccine” for this thing is proving only somewhat effective, and the vaccinated are starting to catch it in droves. It is not a sterilizing immunization, and definitely not a magic bullet.

Bottom line, nobdody here gets out alive.

Live every day as if it might be your last. Be kind to people, love passionately. Do things with enthusiasm and joy. There are no guarantees. I’m living life, and I have no regrets. I’m sorry there are people who are still afraid of this thing that has a 99.x% survival rate. It’s getting ridiculous. Sorry, but that’s my opinion.

Memento Mori.

[DrJazzy]

Don’t know about omicron – but I can say Covid 19 regardless of what variant it is has slammed our facilities since the beggining of the pandemic. It definitely waxes and wanes…but it has certainly, overall, stressed out our resources. The covid gen of docs/residents (not me, I’m fine) are pretty burned out – and considering they were constantly pulled to cover covid shifts, I don’t blame them too much. It’s affected training for basically every specialty – and diverted so much resources into covering covid patients. 

All that said – just as I am against mandates…I am against shutdowns. You can certainly try to be safe not just for yourself but for others…and cont to live life. One of my co-residents was angry about the first Utah game given the large gathering and made a snarky comment – lol I wanted to push back but it wasn’t worth it. If my child was school age I would want him to go to live classes – for him the risk/benefit discussion is essy as covid is really unlikely to cause harm in him and he would lose out more socially from online classes. I believe we as a society should be free to make our own decisions regardless – but that’s me. 

[Stone]

I would vote for you as head of NIH/CDC 🙂

IMO, there need to be more clear-headed people that can break down the risks and speak clearly (and with authority and context) about this stuff. 

[DrJazzy]

The 99% survival rate isn’t quite true – really depends on age and risk stratification. Sorry, just pointing out facts – but I get what you mean.

I see a lot of kids/young healthy adults absolutely devastated by covid – but it’s only because of what I do and the fact that we are a 6 state referral hospital. We’ll see the worst of the worst. I keep telling my wife that if we really hadn’t gotten covid yet and we did get covid…we are in the group that we should be okay. It’s just a numbers game with covid due to its infectivity – even 1% of a gazillion people is going to end up being a high number. 

But just know I agree with your overall philosphy – it’s hard to enjoy life if you are constantly living in fear.