Ute Fan Board

Would you rather…..

Would you rather have a four year starter for football or a two year phenom?

Would you rather have a one and done cycle of amazing players or four year grinders?

@Duhwayne. I think you need a blend to remain healthy as a program but I would much rather have LL grade out well enough to leave in 2016. That means Utah benefitted a lot from his rising draft stock. I would love to see Huntley play himself into the second round. 

  • Duhwayne

    Hey BGU, I hear you. Would be great to see Huntley play that well.

    Re Lowell, my point was more that I wonder if we are evaluating 2017 based on what happened as an UDFA. I think his play dropped off in 2017 but still was pretty damn good. Other than maybe Vea and Maafala, who was obviously better in conference? He clearly had more potential and the shoulder was unfortunate but overall it was great to have him. If he doesn’t want to play anymore, I can’t fault him. When I saw that he didn’t run the 40 and benched 20 reps, I figured he didn’t really want it.

    • BattleGroundUte

      It’s actually an interesting thing to think about. Obviously we want guys to stay and play for Utah as long as they can. On Dline where Utah is so deep much like corner I want to see two and NFL. I fully expect JJ to be gone after this season making a big check. These are the things that lead to winning big games. NFL talent showing out. LL and Mokofisi really never asserted themselves as damn that’s Utah Dline is fierce. 

  • Hammer
    2 1

    Lotulelei Scouting Report – bad work ethic, basically saying lazy / unmotivated

    “Scouts have serious concerns about Lotulelei’s love of football and overall work ethic. He was slow and sloppy this season and his quickness suffered badly because of it. Teams looking to draft him will have to be leaning on his 2015 or 2016 tape because he was a reject in 2017. If he doesn’t commit himself to the work it takes to be a pro, he will have a hard time sticking around.” – OUCH!!!!

    “I was high on him before the year started but he was a major disappointment. He knew this was his year to play well and make money but he did nothing to get rid of all that excess weight and his tape wasn’t very good.” — AFC Director of College Scouting

    https://www.nfl.com/prospects/lowell-lotulelei?id=32462018-0002-5598-15ae-f7cd99a2205a
     
    “Effort appears to be optional for him on this year’s tape” -OUCH!!!!!!!!!
     
    Didn’t Star have the same attitude until he started working as a furniture mover and realized if he’s going to do physical work, he might as well get paid…a lot more?

  • BattleGroundUte
    2

    Kind of a disappointing end to him. I know it is a knock many people stereotypically like to say of Polynesian people. I don’t buy that at all as you see this in a lot of people across all races. 

    Good luck to him in coaching and his future endeavors. 

    • chinngiskhaan
      1

      that sort of thing is bound to happen to some guys in the polynesian culture. When you are poly, living in America, people expect you to play football. In Lowell’s situation, it was only multiplied because of Star. He probably felt like he didn’t have any choice but to play.

       

      That being said, he must have been pretty darn talented to make it as far as he did without really giving damn about football.

  • noneyadb
    3 2

    Have to question the coaching staff and their choices to continue playing him…

  • Duhwayne
    2

    Are we sure we aren’t piling on at this point? Lowell and Mokofisi were a great tandem for multiple years. Stevie T was great too. If you’re a coach with a guy that is good and two guys that are as good or better and they have an extra year to play, wouldn’t you start them?

    Lowell started four years at Utah. That’s a grind. The NFL isn’t for everyone especially if you are worn out and don’t really care. I don’t know if we really need to go back and revise memories over performance at Utah. It seems a littke like piling on. They won games for us last year all through the bowl game. WV’s QB was taking hits all game.

    One more point, if they were really intent on NFL, they should have declared early. You only get so many years with your body. We actually got the benefit of staying in school instead. I am completely comfortable with that.

    Maybe there is a basis for discussion about what to change, but that’s already happened and I for one am not really qualified to critique Powell’s coaching. Coaching has already changed with Andersen on D line. Leki is going to be a monster and so are others. We’re fine.

    • LL would have left in 2016 if not for injury to his shoulder from what I understood. That would have allowed Utah to keep Stevie T. Not piling on just wondering how things could have been different. Stevie T wreaked havoc in 2016(edit thanks Duhwayne) on the Pac and especially Utah. Where I don’t want to say things were worst but they didnt improve upfront under LL and Mokofisi. 

      It is all what ifs and what could have possibly been. To see LL absolutely flake out makes you wonder about his effort the passed two seasons is all. 

    • noneyadb
      3

      I think the bigger issue is having that attitude in the locker room. Players see it. Scouts sure as hell noticed. Fans see it. How many recruits did?

      Personally if kids were taking plays off to this level, they wouldn’t see the field. Hopefully Coach Anderson can correct it.

    • Hammer
      1

      The NFL scout said he was lazy IN GAMES! That stands out to me. I love Fotu. I’d rather have the guy going all out with less talent. Not saying that is Fotu, he’s a beast. But attitude spreads across the whole team.

  • Duhwayne

    Didn’t Stevie play at SC in 2016? I don’t remember. Maybe we’re counting years different?

    • You are correct shoulder injury to LL was 2015 he rehabbed and didn’t regain full function until 2017 his senior season. He didn’t leave 2016 or 2015 because of the shoulder. 

      I have felt the dline has been underperforming to expectations and health has been primarily the problem. Fitts never could stay 100 either. 

  • BattleGroundUte
    2

    PAC12 news I have read

    Shareef O’Neal probably isn’t going to qualify academically for fUCLA. They are a young team but have the sixth best recruiting class in the nation with O’Neal who is the son of Shaq. 

    Oregon dismisses Fotu Leaito after a second arrest. A senior linebacker for them. https://247sports.com/college/oregon/Article/Fotu-Leiato-dismissed-from-the-Oregon-Ducks-football-team-118501466/Amp

  • PlainsUte
    10

    Maybe Leaito will get invited to the Kyle Whittingham Home for Wayward Linebackers.

    • sweetgrass

      LOL

      Tony I am having trouble with the reply box, it isn’t there when I try and reply. I was only able to do this after I submitted and then edited.

      And I’m not using my Atari 800, its a real computer 🙂

  • BattleGroundUte

    Warriors at Rockets

    Dominoes boxing guy has outplayed Durant in this series. 

    Hammer
    2

    Were Lowell and Mokofisi really not that great?

    they were starting as frosh and sophs but never ended All PAC team, right? I mean, statistically, where do they stand in the PAC 12 and nationally.

  • Duhwayne

    They were great. It’s a grind and they chose to retire I guess. Neither of them had great or complete combine numbers, and I think that speaks to their desire to keep going. Wishing them well.

    • PlainsUte
      3

      Just hope it doesn’t color Utah DL, in general, as uncommitted.  Kind of looks bad to sign, take signing bonus, and then quit all within two weeks.

      • Pace Manyung
        3 6

        I agree. Kind of a dirt bag move on both their parts. We don’t know the details but on the surface it feels like they played the system and collected the money. If you’re not into it and don’t have the desire to truly give it all you got – then allow the FA contract go to someone who really wants the chance to fulfill their dreams

      • Onlyu
        17

        Lowell returned his money…not sure about Moko but he probably did as well.  They were both banged up last year and it won’t reflect negatively on the DL unless it becomes a consistent pattern which it won’t.  It’s not as uncommon as you think for a free agent. 

        If your heart is not in playing in “The League” you’re in big trouble.  It was explained to me like this once by one of our guys who played for about 5 years:

        ”They’re animals and they literally are trying to kill you everyday, in every drill.  They might be great guys off the field but some of these guys had nothing growing up and it’s like they know if they don’t make it they’re back to where they came from with nothing.”

        I remember thinking…going to work every day and literally getting into a fistfight with a 320 pound freak of nature that wanted to beat the hell out of me every chance he had would be exhausting from a mental standpoint.  The mental toughness those guys show is unreal.

        • PlainsUte

          I thought the grind was not so much on getting beat up by other players (there are limited drills with pads) rather in the amount of conditioning that is required to compete for a roster spot at that level.   Given how much many people dream of playing in the big leagues of any sport, seems crazy to hang up cleats so suddenly after being handed an opportunity — maybe its just me being stubborn and relentless in pursuing what I decide to pursue.

  • BattleGroundUte

    Did they live up to hype I think is a better question. 

    Lotulelei hurt himself so I don’t fault him for that. Mokofisi idk I think he overperformed to his hype if he had any. 

  • chinngiskhaan
    4 1

    they were not even close to great their senior years. They had a few great games at the end of the season, but the rest of the season they were basically non existent.

     

    The tragedy here is that they could have been All Americans, and that would have made our defensive ends, linebackers, and DBs that much better. Unfortunately, these two not playing up to their skill level is why we lost a few games last year.

  • noneyadb
    2 1

    Colorado and West Virginia are terrible teams to try and evaluate anybody against.
    Question- Were Lowell and Mokofisi part of the group upset with the Huntley over Williams decision?

    • SUUte
      3

      That question seems irrelevant. What does that have to do with their leaving the league? So you are saying their decrease in stats was due to their disagreement with the starting QB? Seems asinine. 

      • Grayshirt
        1 1

        So, you are saying that a persons attitude and performance at work are not related?  Seems asinine. 

      • noneyadb
        2

        Wtf? Completely relevant question in reply to “they were not even close to great their senior years. They had a few great games at the end of the season, but the rest of the season they were basically non existent” try to keep up…

        • chinngiskhaan

          Yeah, west virginia was terrible, as was colorado… I’m not arguing that one bit. Just saying that they played really well toward the end of the season, whatever the reason.

          I’d be the first to tell you I was disgusted with how they played last year. If that had played up to potential, we would have won the south easily.

  • TexanUte
    3

    Oh please give me a break on feeling bad for the poor NFL even if they didnt have to pay back their signing bonuses. No other league is more of a business with the owners looking after their interests above and beyond those of any players. They cut (without pay in many cases) players routinely who they perceive to be under performing and don’t have to pay more for over performance.

  • Kuzma tweet, awesome goal.

    https://twitter.com/Lakers/status/999041201163550720?s=20

    TONY!

    Just saw that today is Tony’s wedding anniversary. Happy Anniversary Tony, and thank you for this website, all the golf learnin’, and delicious brats and brews at 69 by the Dumpster. You’re good people, brother. GO UTES!

  • Tony
    8

    Thanks brother. Taking bride of admin to din tonight at the Red Iguana for our 8 year. It was her choice and I’m totally down.

  • Mokofisi retiring now to

  • Jim Fassel Fan
    6

    *too

  • Stone

    What is the reason for a “retirement” announcement (versus just no longer trying out for a team)? Is there some requirement that they officially retire to alert other teams that the player does not want to be contacted, some financial aspect, collective bargaining agreement aspect, or is it just to let people know that the NFL did not reject them, they rejected the NFL? If they later change their mind, do they need to officially “unretire” or can they just start playing again?

    • gothamute

      I think it has to do with the fact that a player who is under contract can’t just decide it’s not working out with a particular team and go try somewhere else. The only way they can “opt out” is to formally retire and let the clock run out on their contract, although this may not be as simple as time passing on the calendar (because under the CBA the clock might be based on accrued seasons, i.e. periods in which you were active etc). I think paying back the full signing bonus helps facilitate moving on either because of some impact on how the clock counts in that instance or because the team is more likely to cut the player loose if they’re not out any money. More detail can be found here:

      https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/pittsburgh-steelers-nfl-features-news-blog-long-form/2016/3/5/11158958/nfl-101-how-cuts-retirements-and-trades-affect-the-salary-cap

      Retirement section highlights below:

      “Retirements

      Teams can end a contract at any time, but so can players. In a player’s case, though, the only way they can do this is by retiring. In the end, though, the math looks pretty much the same as if the player had been cut — and the June 1 rule applies here, too.

      For instance, if our player from the example above had retired instead of being cut, his money would account the same way as if he had been cut by the team. If he files his retirement paperwork on or after June 1, the money counts as if he was cut on or after June 1.

      Just like anything else in the NFL, though, there is a “but” for this rule, too: if the player retires with time remaining on his contract, then chooses to come back into the league later, he is not a free agent. Contracts apply, in most cases, to accrued seasons, not calendar years. If the player doesn’t play, he doesn’t accrue a season. Therefore, his return to the field would put him back under the control of the same team, unless that team chooses to cut him. This rule is part of the reason why Barry Sanders chose to retire: the Lions refused to cut him, and he decided he’d rather stop playing altogether than play another season for Detroit. Conversely, Brett Favreretired, and then the team chose to cut him while he was retired. He was then able to return to the league later as a free agent.

      Okay, there are actually two “buts” for retirements. When a player retires, the team has the option to pursue the return of a portion of the signing bonus equal to the unplayed portions of the contract, and that money is no longer counted against the salary cap. This is typically done through an arbitrator. This is known as the “Barry Sanders Rule” because this is exactly how the situation played out in his case, as he was required to pay back a portion of his bonus. The difference between now and then is there was no precedent when Sanders played; now, it’s explicitly written into the CBA to allow for this arbitration.”

      • Stone

        Great explanation, thank you.

        So any idea why Mokofisi and Lowell issued a formal “retirement”? Are they trying to sign on with another team? If not, and they just don’t want to play football anymore, is there a reason to announce a formal retirement?

        • gothamute
          1

          In Lowell’s case, he has said since the announcement that he wants to get into coaching, so he may actually be done (apparently scouts had real doubts about how committed he was to playing, which is why he didn’t get drafted). Flip’s agent says he’s taking some “time off” which makes me think that maybe he wasn’t going to make the team or it wasn’t a good fit and he’s not ready to hang it up for good just yet… but that’s just speculation since there’s not much reporting beyond the issued statements at this point.

    • gothamute

      I think it has to do with the fact that a player who is under contract can’t just decide it’s not working out with a particular team and go try somewhere else. The only way they can “opt out” is to formally retire and let the clock run out on their contract, although this may not be as simple as time passing on the calendar (because under the CBA the clock might be based on accrued seasons, i.e. periods in which you were active etc). I think paying back the full signing bonus helps facilitate moving on either because of some impact on how the clock counts in that instance or because the team is more likely to cut the player loose if they’re not out any money. More detail can be found here:

      https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/pittsburgh-steelers-nfl-features-news-blog-long-form/2016/3/5/11158958/nfl-101-how-cuts-retirements-and-trades-affect-the-salary-cap

      Retirement section highlights below:

      “Retirements

      Teams can end a contract at any time, but so can players. In a player’s case, though, the only way they can do this is by retiring. In the end, though, the math looks pretty much the same as if the player had been cut — and the June 1 rule applies here, too.

      For instance, if our player from the example above had retired instead of being cut, his money would account the same way as if he had been cut by the team. If he files his retirement paperwork on or after June 1, the money counts as if he was cut on or after June 1.

      Just like anything else in the NFL, though, there is a “but” for this rule, too: if the player retires with time remaining on his contract, then chooses to come back into the league later, he is not a free agent. Contracts apply, in most cases, to accrued seasons, not calendar years. If the player doesn’t play, he doesn’t accrue a season. Therefore, his return to the field would put him back under the control of the same team, unless that team chooses to cut him. This rule is part of the reason why Barry Sanders chose to retire: the Lions refused to cut him, and he decided he’d rather stop playing altogether than play another season for Detroit. Conversely, Brett Favreretired, and then the team chose to cut him while he was retired. He was then able to return to the league later as a free agent.

      Okay, there are actually two “buts” for retirements. When a player retires, the team has the option to pursue the return of a portion of the signing bonus equal to the unplayed portions of the contract, and that money is no longer counted against the salary cap. This is typically done through an arbitrator. This is known as the “Barry Sanders Rule” because this is exactly how the situation played out in his case, as he was required to pay back a portion of his bonus. The difference between now and then is there was no precedent when Sanders played; now, it’s explicitly written into the CBA to allow for this arbitration.”

  • Onlyu
    13

    100 Days!!

    Everything in place for a special season.  EVERYTHING!!!!

    Need things to break our way with health and a lucky bounce here or there and we’ll play for a Pac12 Championship in December!

    Cannot wait to see this group play!!

  • ironman1315
    6

    You stop that with your optimism. We are utes dammit. We need nothing but cynicism and rage. 

  • PlainsUte
    1

    Lets hope there are no off-season shenanigans resulting in Ute player suspensions or disqualifications.

    Meanwhile I am sure the Provostan folks will provide some unintended comedy/entertainment value at some point during the summer.

    • BattleGroundUte
      1

      Dude you just jinxed it, 

    • Hoo Ray Who?
      1

      While I refuse to post a link to their board, I will admit to perusing it for the entertainment. Just laighed my ass off at a thread wherein they were arguing with each other about how they’re a better, more prestigious program than Boise State. BUT THEY DON’T EVEN HAVE A NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP. You really can’t make this stuff up. 

  • Johnny80
    1 1

    So excited for the upcoming season! Now what to do with the next 99 days….

  • Ziggy Ziggler
    1

    2019 recruiting

    What are the most pressing needs for the football team?  Who does it appear that we are going after the hardest?