Letter to Trib says Utah basketball players dishonor flag and anthem

[Tony (admin)]

This is one of the dumbest letters to the editor in the history of letters to the editor:

http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/4818220-156/utes-dishonor-flag-and-anthem

I’ve already left a comment.  This is either a complete dumbass or a zoob troll.  

[ironman1315]

I am dumber for having read that. I award you and the letter writer no points. And may god of mercy on both of your souls.

[Tony (admin)]

Don’t shoot the messenger. I couldn’t help but leave a comment.

[ironman1315]

I shoot who I shoot. And since I can’t shoot Dangus McGee that wrote the letter I’m shooting you.

[AZswayze]

I sat behind some guy at the Arizona/Utah football game who said to his wife that he was gonna slap anybody he saw not holding their hand over their heart during the national anthem. This was around the time of the Kaepernick situation. I consider myself fairly patriotic, and while I’m not typically confrontational I had to test the dude. He looked around during the national anthem, which sorta seems just as “unpatriotic”, but did nothing to me or a handful of others with our hands at our sides. I have to wonder if it was the same douche who wrote this tripe.

[utefansince79]

I stand at attention and hold my hand over my heart during the anthem, partly because I am proud to live in a country where we have the right to choose whether to do so or not, unlike some nations where one would be locked up or even shot for not honoring their nation’s flag.

 

[AZswayze]

But, are you gonna kick my ass if I don’t.

[utefansince79]

No certainly will not do so nor be offended in any way by those who use their freedom to either sit down and/or not hold their hand over their heart.

 

Let freedom ring

 

[Utah]

There is nothing worse than uneducated extreme right/extreme left person. Morons.

[Puget Ute]

Good comment, Tony. I can’t figure out why that guy wants the players to act like they are wearing the uniform and are required to stand at attention during the SSB.

[bopahull]

Traditionally teams have in the past stood at attention with hand over heart. As an old Ute fan I would like to see our players continue that tradition. On the other hand, it is completely voluntary and doesn’t detract from my personal feelings of patriotism. To each his own.

[leftyjace]

Nor is standing straight at attention in any way disrespectful to the flag.

If people would do a little research, they would find that holding the hand over the heart is a relatively new phenomenon that was a result of the McCarthy era.

It is just as respectful to stand at attention with hands at sides or behind the back as it is to put the hand over the heart.

As for me, I am oftentimes wearing a hat. It’s also quite easy to take the hat off with my right hand and simply hold it over my heart as part of not having it on my head.

I have a helluva lot harder time with idiots that don’t remove their hat than those that don’t put their hand over the heart.

[PlainsUte]

I wonder what David Haughty’s kooterboard user name is??   Does he complain when other men in his ward don’t wear white shirts on Sunday?

[Puget Ute]

He does have an appropriate last name though.

[autahfan]

It’s one of the rare opportunities I have to express some degree of gratitude and respect for those who sacrificed everything. I don’t feel I’m worshipping a piece of cloth or that its paganistic or that it’s a political statement. It’s just an act that reminds me of how much I owe other people for what I have. Would I bench a player who didn’t comply? If it’s a college player who’s a US Citizen? Probably. I’d feel I have a duty to teach some amount of respect and humility. In the Pro’s all bets are off. There it’s just about the league’s image and I’m not there to do anything but help us win.

[Utah]

True, and your reality is very real and very applicable here…BUT, these guys might have different realities than you. They may have grown up in a US where a very troubling figure was just elected president. They have grown up in a US where their parents might not have been allowed to attend “white” schools. They are living in a state that is run by a religion that seems to love discrimination against anyone not their own.

Your US might be a different US than their US.

Neither is wrong, but, you both might be right in your actions as well.

[Anonymous]

When you are in a uniform representing a particular brand or university. Your right to do what you want doesn’t over ride consequences if that brand wants to remove you. 

That is my problem with all of this people think doing what I want means no consequence. 

[Utah]

I’m sorry. I missed the part where the University of Utah has an issue with what they did. 

[Anonymous]

You seem to be the one speaking in generalities. If you want to speak about spefics I will. 

[Utah]

Huh? I spoke in extremely specific terms. 

Then you brought up Utah’s brand and I spoke extremely specifically again, apologized, because apparently Utah has an issue with their behavior and I didn’t know about…

According to you, that is. So, where did you get your information about how Utah is not pleased with the basketball players? 

[Anonymous]

I didn’t bring up Utah’s brand at all.

My reply is to your statement just because someone’s paradigm view is this, doesn’t mean they can act however they want. When you represent a company if you choose to voice your opinion a particular way according to your paradigm it doesn’t absolve you of consequences.

Edit: I am not even touching on your slippery slope of moral relativity based on your empirical view.

[Utah]

Uhhhh…you specifically said:

“When you are in a uniform representing a particular brand…”

Now, where did I, or anyone else, say that they could act however they wanted to? All I said was that there may be more than one side to the issue, and until I know more information, I’ll give both sides a pass, because there is a chance that BOTH sides are right.

You are the king of straw men.

“Your right to do what you want doesn’t over ride consequences if that brand wants to remove you.”

Where was Utah saying they weren’t happy with what they did?

“I didn’t bring up Utah’s brand at all.”

Ok.

“My reply is to your statement just because someone’s paradigm view is this, doesn’t mean they can act however they want.”

Where did anyone say they could act without consequences?

“When you represent a company if you choose to voice your opinion a particular way according to your paradigm it doesn’t absolve you of consequences.”

Ok, where was Utah not happy with the players? Where did the Utah players ever voice an opinion?

“Edit: I am not even touching on your slippery slope of moral relativity based on your empirical view.”

Ha ha. Ok.

 

[Anonymous]

I took your reply as very general. I am also speaking in very general terms. 

Now read my statement from a general point of view in regards to the person you are replying to. 

[rbmw263]

“the Utes swayed side to side like waves”

 

Maybe because of the rush of adrenaline players experience while amping themselves up for a game. This guy is desperately looking for things to get angry about. He sounds miserable.

[GameForAnyFuss]

I take it this guy wasn’t at the MLS championship game in 2013 (RSL @ Kansas City) where it was 4 degrees at kickoff. There was practically a little track meet going on on the field during the anthem. Though presumably it was not due to lack of patriotism, but rather an attempt to keep calf muscles from becoming the consistency of chicken drumsticks in the frozen food aisle during all that standing around in near-zero temps.

[Minnesota Ute]

I think it is simply not widely understood that you should put your hand over your heart for the Anthem.  I have always stood at attention, faced the flag, and sang the words, and IF I had a hat, I would put that over my heart, but if not wearing a hat, I would stand at attention with my hands behind my back.  And largely because I didn’t know that hand over heart was a “thing” (other than the pledge) and I basically followed the lead of nearly EVERYONE else in the gym.  It continues to this day, I go to a lot of HS basketball games and I bet there is less than 25% that put their hand over their heart if they are not wearing a hat.  

There is no disrespect intended, there just is not broad understanding of this expectation.  I in fact didn’t even believe it, so I did some research when this whole Kaepernick thing blew up and was actually very surprised to see that this is actually an expectation, but as pointed out elsewhere in this thread, this was an invention of the McCarthy era.  As a libertarian, I have no problem with people’s right to express their views in whatever way, sitting or turning back, even though I may not agree or particulary like it.  But I have a real problem with smear campaigns that try to make something INTO a statement, when it clearly isn’t.

[BioUte]

https://www.linkedin.com/in/dave-haughey-66a7536a

Looks like he’s a Ute, Ret. Marine COL

[Utahute72]

When I was on active duty I was taught to stop, face the flag, salute if in uniform or simply stand at attention if not.

[Coreyc04]

As one who goes to the bathroom because I do not want to participate in these governmental festivities I find this absolutely hillarious. I understand why those who stand and those who don’t salute. Everyone is different and needs to be respected because we all have different beliefs and backgrounds. I don’t care if you salute the flag, don’t salute the flag or don’t participate at all. We all have a different idea of what a song and a symbol means to us.

[AZswayze]

Why the bathroom? Sounds more like a form of protest than apathy. Is this GSU?

[Utahute72]

Or a tiny bladder.