Is It BadMouthing

[Utah5410]

The Big -12 to say that the Pac is much better in football ? Given the teams in the conference v the team we will be playing ? It’s just a fact. Better football overall. I’m glad we are in a conference but minus the terrible officials I wish we were staying in the Pac.. But, it is what it is and we move froward.

[belli1976]

Should we have a date for an over under for when most of us will start complaining about the Big 12 refs?

[Milton Vanderslice]

It’s honest to say that without the 2/4 Pac12 members joining next year, the entire conference SOS would plummet to ACC levels.

[Dallas]

The malfeasance of the pac12 admin is no more apparent than by comparing the crappy schools in the remaining B12 vs the elite level academics and quality football programs in Pac12 even w/o SC and ucla, and somehow the pac12 colapses. We are objectively moving to a worse conference—that isn’t controversial. Those who argue otherwise are fighting an inferiority complex. Who wouldn’t be upset with the pac12 admin and incredulous at the result? Grateful to be in B12 and looking forward to the new matchups while also acknowledging our old conference and foes were better.

[PlainsUte]

Interesting stat about Big-12 football: Oklahoma has won 14 conference championships, Baylor, Texas and K-State 3 each. 4 were won by teams no longer in the conference (Nebraska 2, CU 1, A&M 1). Baylor is currently in a down cycle (will Aranda be retained?) and K-State was best under Coach Bill Snyder. Currently there are 2 teams in the Pac-12 in the AP Top-10; none in the reconstituted Big-12. AP Top 25 has two Big-12 teams ex OU/Texas (at 19 K-State, 21 Oklahoma State), Pac-12: 4. So I think its fair to say the Big-12 without Texas and Oklahoma are pretty weak in football compared to 2023 Pac-12. Basketball is a completely different story.

[2008 National Champ]

So I think its fair to say the Big-12 without Texas and Oklahoma are pretty weak in football compared to 2023 Pac-12.

That’s not really a fair comparison. Texas and Oklahoma are two of the top 3 programs in the Big-12 this year. From the opposite side, one could say remove Oregon and Washington from the Pac and 2023 looks pretty weak.

K-State won the Big-12 last year with the exact same record as Utah did. The last time Oklahoma State had a losing record was 2005 (Gundy’s first year). TCU has been in the CFP and Baylor has been on the CFP bubble multiple times. Iowa State has made an NY6 bowl.

The point is that just because Utah fans are more familiar with PAC schools doesn’t mean that they are intrinsically better. The biggest brands from the PAC all went to the BIG so I’m not sure that the Big-12 is any more worried about Utah, Colorado and the Arizona’s than the other way around.

[Utah]

It’s not a fair comparison.

BUT

Most of the people complaining about “Utah bagging on the Big 12” are teams that will be in the Big 12 next year. And they aren’t that great. They aren’t Texas, Oklahoma, USC, UW, Oregon.

Look, Utah is going from a conference where there was a true blue blood in USC and multiple teams with higher profiles than any Big 12 team that is staying: Oregon, UW, Stanford, Cal, UCLA.

Utah is going from a conference where they are the fourth best program…to a conference where they are heads and tails the best program.

If you can’t see how that is a step down (not you specifically, but Big 12 fan) then I can’t help you. It’s ok to be disappointed.

[UTE98]

One could argue Utah has been the best Pac12 football program over the past six years. Four conference championship appearances, two rose bowls and ranked in so many CFP rankings.

Who compares to that in the BigXII?

[PlainsUte]

It is fair because Texas and Oklahoma will be out of the reconstituted Big-12, and you just named 4 such programs that are in the current Pac-12. Yes, given recent results, K-State and Oklahoma State, along with Arizona, and we’ll see what happens to CU, will be the greatest threats to Utah in Big-12 football. Perhaps “weak” is the wrong word to use, I don’t mean to imply the former Pac-12 teams will dominate, but they’ll have an easier road that competing with USC, Oregon, Washington, UCLA and even Oregon State of late.

[2008 National Champ]

I only said the comparison wasn’t fair because you were removing Texas and Oklahoma, while not removing anyone from the PAC. Remove Michigan and Ohio State from the B1G, Alabama and Georgia from the SEC.,, everyone is always going to pale in comparison when you take away the top performers.

I think Utah will do well next year but the league isn’t going to be a pushover. No one likes it when I point it out but the fact is that in Utah’s P5 history, only once have they had a one-loss regular season. So while they’ve been better than most, they haven’t been elite. Good enough to get to the CCG and get into the playoff under the 12 team rules but not good enough to get into an NY6 game (even in 2019) unless they win the CCG.

If you are a fan of a Big 12 team, you expect Utah to throw up their usual 9-3 type season. You admit that Utah will be a problem but you probably aren’t scared that they are going to dominate the league before a game has ever been played. And I don’t think that is any different than how we would feel if 4 of the Big 12 teams were to join the PAC without Oregon, SC, UCLA and UW.

[Jim Vanderhoof]

We will have our hands full with the Big 12. Road games will be hard even against weaker opponents. With Texas and Oklahoma gone and the expanded playoffs the door is wide open.

The Big 12 was down this year. That can change in a year or two. The Pac 12 was horrible two years ago. BYU went 5-0. This year they would be 0-5.

The Utes will be competitive but need to play good to win. It will fun to see new teams and how we stack up in the conference.

[Utah]

I would like to know what team in the Big 12 is better than Utah.

What team in the Big 12 has won the Big 12 the last two years? What team has been in the title game the last 4 years?

Oh yeah. That team is leaving.

Forgive me if I don’t fear the Big 12. We recruit better than any team. We have been ranked higher consistently than any other team. We’ve won more.

Are there good teams in the Big 12? Absolutely. And they can definitely beat us.

But we will be favored to win the Big 12 next year.

[2008 National Champ]

TCU finished 2nd last year and made the playoff. They are staying.
Kansas State won the Big-12 last year. They are staying.
Texas has made one NY6 game in the last 13 years with 5 losing seasons in that time. They are leaving.
Oklahoma is the one elite program in the Big-12. They are leaving.

NY6 games by the teams staying over the last 10 years:

2014 – TCU, Baylor
2015 – Oklahoma State
2019 – Baylor
2020 – Iowa State
2021 – Baylor, Oklahoma State
2022 – TCU (playoff), Kansas State

NY6 games for the 4 PAC teams moving to the Big-12, same time period:

2021 – Utah
2022 – Utah

[Jim Vanderhoof]

Didn’t TCU make it to the CFP and beat Michigan last year? Oregon barely beat a bad Texas Tech team that lost to BYU. You act like it’s going to be a cake walk. That’s the attitude that upsets the other fan bases. Respect is earned not a given.

If you’re Ohio St Georgia Alabama maybe you have a point. Didn’t we just get humiliated by Arizona? Let’s be realistic with our expectations.