We Can Still Win Without Cam

[Utah5410]

Guys our D is Legit… I’ve Heard Pepa and Tufuna Are back. DM is still a freshman who has never played outside of CA. First True Road Game Being Played in RES. UCLA has played no one and this team as been through so much adversity. NJ has the poise to get it done. I’m much more worried about next week than this week. It will be a tough game. But Utes by 7….. 20-13.

[22Ute22]

We can, but it’s going to be hard fought and will come down to the wire imo. Right now I’d say Utah has the better defense, but UCLA has the much better offense. Our defense will have to play lights out and keep the crowd into it. Very disappointed it’s come to this though.

[ProudUte]

Our offense has some serious issues. I would feel a lot better about things if Bernard was playing. So, at the very least we will be without QB1, TE1, RB1.5, and our starting center and maybe WR2.

Can we win? Of course, we can but I think it is going to take an amazing defensive effort, no turnovers, and some good bounces.

We may lose and that will be frustrating since we had such high hopes for this team. But, Nate Johnson is going to get some serious D1 experience and he will be a better player because of it.

Go Utes!!!

[22Ute22]

That’s great experience for Nate, but we are playing for this season. All the other guys deserve the highest percent chance to win, and our coaches blew it by not going for a transfer QB.

[Yergensen]

Nope, we missed wildly with plug and play transfer QBs. Both were straight up broken. Nate just needs some more experience. If that comes with some losses, so be it. We’ll be better for it in the long term.

[22Ute22]

Ok? So because it worked out badly before, it will always work out badly? Guess we might as well never sign another 4 star QB since Costelli and Tuttle transferred out and were terrible.

[2008 National Champ]

Transfer QB’s in and of themselves aren’t a bad thing but I think it helps to know the true potential of what you are getting.

Bo Nix was considered a 5 star bust. Joined his first OC and was able to show why he was so highly regarded.
Michael Penix showed talent but couldn’t stay healthy. Joined his former OC and is now a Heisman candidate.

[Central Coast Ute]

Which good QB transfer do you think would transfer here knowing Cam is still here?

[22Ute22]

Spencer Sanders.

[Central Coast Ute]

Who?

[D T]

Our depth at all those positions is legitimate.

[chinngiskhaan]

Disagree. We don’t even have solid starters at WR. Saying we have solid depth there is blatant homerism. The quality from wr 1 to 2 is basically the same because both are mediocre options. We also don’t have solid depth at TE. Yassmin has been MIA, and the next guy up has only been playing TE for a few months.

Our depth isn’t terrible, but it isn’t solid either.

[22Ute22]

Do we actually know how good they are though? Barnes couldn’t find an open WR or TE to save his life in the Baylor game. Our coaching staff clearly doesn’t like our QB’s to throw 50/50 balls to WR’s/TE’s, or else we would do it more often. They also only trust Nate with half the playbook, and he’s unpolished anyway. There have been some plays where Nate makes the wrong read, and that’s expected given his inexperience. I have a hard time believing that Utah is the only team in the pac 12 that can’t get good WR’s, except for 1 every 4-5 years. At some point you have to blame the coaching, scheme, or offensive philosophy, rather than the majority of WR’s that have come through the program in the past 12 years. I remember Covey being on an interview and he discussed the lack of passing game. I know I’ve seen Kenneth Scott discussing the lack of passing game before. Solomon Enis had a tweet during the Florida game about us passing the ball on the first play. To me, Whitt doesn’t really trust the WR’s/TE’s. The only way he trusts one of them is if they are an all-conference caliber player. I’m convinced that the only way Whitt would ever want a 50/50 ball thrown to a WR, is if he had a prime Randy Moss or Calvin Johnson on his team.

[chinngiskhaan]

That is certainly a valid argument, at least with respect to the WR (still somewhat valid with the TEs I guess). I would argue that we have some evidence that it is a talent issue though (which is also a coaching issue if you think about it). Kincaid and Kuithe have been our top pass catchers over the last few years. Our offense was tailored to their skillsets because they were the best players on our offense. Kincaid has backed that up with getting immediate playing time in the NFL. If the WRs were as good as those guys, the offense would have been tailored to feature them more. I do believe that some of the lack of WR production comes down to Cam’s tunnel vision, but I think he would have tunnel vision with WRs instead of TEs if the WRs were better.

Recruiting rankings would also back up the idea that our WRs aren’t great compared to the rest of the team. I could be wrong, but IIRC they were one of our least highly rated groups over the last few years.

[22Ute22]

No matter what, it has to be a coaching thing, whether it be recruiting, scheme, or development. Look at the top 5 WR yardage leaders from last year. You would probably expect them all to be highly recruited guys from elite schools, right? Nope.

1) Nathaniel Dell, 0.77 rated recruit. Houston cougars.
2) Charlie Jones, 0.77 rated recruit. Purdue
3) Rashee Rice, 0.87 rated recruit. SMU
4) Malachi Corley, 0.77 rated recruit. Western Kentucky.
5) Jalin Hyatt, 0.95 rated recruit. Tennessee

As you can see, you don’t need elite recruits to have good WR play. The more and more I look into it, I’m starting to think it’s coaching failure one way or another. I don’t know why our entire fanbase has always thought our WR’s have sucked for the past 12 years. Other schools don’t seem to have a problem with WR’s that are rated similarly or lower than our recruits. Honestly, I might make a post about this in the future with more datapoints, because it’s an interesting topic.

[chinngiskhaan]

I agree that it is a coaching thing one way or another. Recruiting/developing/scheme, its all on the coaching.

What I’m suggesting is that if the WRs were better (I’m not claiming it is their fault that they aren’t), they would potentially be featured more in the offense. Covey was a legitimately talented WR, he got plenty of catches. Carrington was legitimately talented, he also got plenty of catches. Time Patrick got plenty of touches as well (our QB wasn’t great, so we didn’t throw it much, but when we did it was usually in his direction).

Based on what the coaches have said in the past, particularly when Ludwig has said that he designed the offense to fit our talent (Kuithe/Kincaid), I have to assume he would design it differently if our WRs were as (or more) capable as our TEs.

[22Ute22]

The only guarantee is that it’ll never get fixed under Whitt. Hopefully Scalley is different in regards to his offense when he’s a coach.

[D T]

With your vast experience playing the game, nobody can match your wealth of knowledge regarding our WR/TE rooms & our depth in general….Congratulations.

[chinngiskhaan]

ad hominem attack when you have no response. Classic.

[D T]

What’s there to respond to? I mean, your obvious prowess on the field has no match.

Again, congratulations.

[Charlie]

Good grief, we are 3 and 0, two time defending champs, recruiting better than ever in our history, with so much to look forward to as guys come back. There are 8 ranked teams in our league but everyone wants Utah’s spot or wants to be more like Utah in several aspects. We encounter a massive number of injuries resulting in games being closer than the liking for some fans. We should have more interest in the development that is taking place. Why search and search for the weakest part of the team when every good teams has points weaker than their strong points? I am happy with what the new WR coach is developing. We are doing well with QB3, try to imagine any team in the league or the country with QB3 and QB4. Some who have watched a team go to QB3 would view this as amazing.

There are legitimate questions like why aren’t the TEs targeted more or why isn’t the kickoff coverage not better even without a touchback. These things take watching practice for good football minds to understand. I feel we have a good group of coaches that have and are dealing with adversity as well as can be expected. Don’t get caught up in the logic that short of perfection is every aspect is due to a coaching failure. Be careful when judging people at the top of their profession doing something you have never attempted.

Sorry for the rant, I just happen to like our coaches. Sit back and watch the season develop and know it is not a massive failure to come in 3rd or 4th place in the league this year. We have as much going for us as any others have for now.

[Redblood]

All depends on whether we can stop the run. If we don’t, and we didn’t last year, there is O pressure on their young QB. If we do, it will be tough sledding for him.

Last year we got smoked on both lines of scrimmage, that can’t happen this year if we expect to win.

[GameForAnyFuss]

I don’t know how you can conclude that UCLA has the better offense. They have played 3 bad teams. They may have the better offense or they may not – there is no evidence yet to support either conclusion.

All I know is they have a true freshman QB who hasn’t faced anything resembling a good college defense. Who knows what he will do under pressure? He may throw INTs. He may take sacks. Or he may scramble out of it and gash us for big plays. But to say conclusively that UCLA has the better offense is way premature.

[The Miami Ute]

To me, there’s no doubt that Dante Moore is a legit QB. That being said, he’s played less than 3 college games and doesn’t have full command of the playbook (straight from Chip Kelly himself). In addition, UCLA has only played 2 mediocre G5 schools and a mediocre to bad HBCU. Based on that, it’s really hard to get impressed with UCLA since they really haven’t played anyone of note. Yeah, they have some athletes on both sides of the ball and Utah might struggle to move the football. That being said, I just find it hard to believe that Moore will thrive given the environment and the complexity of the defense that he’s about to face. He’s not Caleb Williams, he’s not Jayden de Laura, he’s not even Cameron Ward, and Utah has had an answer for all those guys.

[22Ute22]

I agree, but that’s basically the situation Utah is in right now. Inexperienced QB that doesn’t have command of the whole playbook, and a good defense. This game might turn into the sickos game of the week.

[The Miami Ute]

Yeap, it might come down to turnovers.

[Central Coast Ute]

Utah offense couldn’t get to 30 against Weber. You’ll have to excuse me if I’m a little pessimistic. NJ could have used the first two full games

[EagleMountainUte]

I think NJ has an easier challenge against the fUCLA defense than Moore has against Utah’s defense AT HOME.

If Pepa and Tafuna play it gets even worst for Moore.

[Central Coast Ute]

Definitely. I’d hate to be a freshman QB playing the Utes at RES. looking at the schedule, this actually makes sense. Someone on this board stated Cam will be back for Cal. If not Weber Cal is probably the best choice before they get into the hardest part of the schedule.

[EagleMountainUte]

I have stopped worrying about it for what it is worth. This Utah defense is legit. I would probably feel more comfortable knowing about the kicking game situation over Rising.

Rising’s actual ability post injury is something more concerning than NJ playing.

[Central Coast Ute]

You’re probably right. I wouldn’t be surprised at this point if NJ would be able to do more with his body than Rising can. The experience and the leadership factor Rising brings is key though. Although the team did seem to respond well to NJ during the Baylor game.

[rbmw263]

find a way…lets f**king go Nate