What was the announced attendance last night?

[ProudUte]

I could not tell from the TV.

[NarfUte]

3137. Not great.

[Staples]

Box score had it as 3137, which is pretty accurate. It was actually a fairly decent turnout by the MUSS, but overall there weren’t a ton of people there.

[Tony (admin)]

Man. At what point does MBB start losing money? Maybe it already is.

[The Miami Ute]

My guess is that football’s been subsidizing all other sports for years.

[ProudUte]

I think the Red Rocks may be in the black. Basketball is in trouble. I am not sure what needs to be done other than getting a better team. Competing with the Jazz is also a problem.

[GameForAnyFuss]

I am not sure what needs to be done other than getting a better team.

Maybe it would help if fans started showing up.

For the record, I don’t think you’ll get a better team until after fans come. Good players will go to where there’s full arenas and good NIL deals. You don’t get those things until you have fans.

[Charlie]

Exactly. Coaches have their job to do. Players have their job to do. Fans have support to do. When any of the three wait for the others, progress is slow at best. A wise man once said things happen for only one of two reasons: chance or you make it happen. As fans, if you have spending money you can help the administration and influence coaching. Otherwise the only other job is support. There was/is a sign in the football building: ‘Just do your job. in the interest of full disclosure, I was not there last night…

[Tony (admin)]

What came first the chicken or the egg?

[The Miami Ute]

I know that the Red Rocks continually draw big crowds but I don’t know if they’re making a profit. I mean, I only pay $70 for two season tickets. Maybe they are if you include concessions sales. As to the basketball team, I think that the answer is as simple as winning. If the Utes had a return to what they were under Big Rick, I think that the team would draw big crowds consistently again.

[Staples]

At some point I guess we just have to admit that there aren’t very many basketball fans out there and the crowds won’t ever be what they once were. This team has won 20 games, gone 15-2 at home (and the ASU was the only stinker, the U of A triple OT loss was a great game), has been a fun team to watch (if exasperating at times), and fans are still in a wait and see attitude? People can use whatever excuse they want, but at the end of the day you’re a fair weather fan if you’re waiting for the ghost of Big Rick to make an appearance.

[FountainofUte]

I don’t necessarily disagree with anything you’re saying, but I think what you are underestimating and what the university of Utah is also underestimating is that fans don’t just want a good team. They want a good program.

Good programs don’t peak by going to the NIT or going to the NCAA tournament as a one-and-done. Good programs have varying levels of success, but you can see when the team is building towards something big. I think any fan who is in wait-and-see mode can see that this program isn’t out of that swirl yet of peaking at very mediocre levels.

Speaking for myself, I think that’s what would pull me back in at least from a standpoint of being more tempted to get season tickets and attend a few games. I want to see the program is building toward bigger things. By contrast, here was a team full of upperclassman talent and an all-time player in Carlson and it’s still yielded an NIT. Do you expect fans to get excited about that?

So, it’s not just about reaching Majerus levels of success. I think a lot of us know that that is a longshot and rare air to get into as a program. But it’s not all or nothing. We can still be a good and successful program without competing for the championship every year. But I think fans want a program that goes to the tournament more than zero times in eight years.

That’s the trick. I get the chicken and egg argument about fans showing up and the team being good. But I think the only realistic shot is that the “egg” has to be the team being good in this instance. I know it’s super hard but some coach has to come in here and build a winner without fans. It sucks, but that’s the reality. 

[MDUte]

100% this ^

Making it to the NCAA Tourney doesn’t mean you’re a Final Four, Elite 8, or even Sweet 16 caliber program. It’s merely the bare minimum of what should be expected MOST every year in order to expect Utah’s fanbase to show up.Making it to the NIT is a failed season and only shows how far the program has fallen to have diehard fans demanding the rest of the fanbase to be excited enough for an NIT invite to show up to games.

[Gugstanley]

I don’t think the Red Rocks have ever broke even. Now they don’t sell out or even come close

[The Miami Ute]

I have to disagree. I’ve been a season ticket holder for three seasons and, when it’s time to renew, there are few tickets available for purchase and all of those are in the upper bowl. I’ve also gone to the vast majority of their meets for the last four seasons and, if the Huntsman isn’t packed, it’s certainly mostly full. Suffice it to say that both MBB and WBB would love to get crowds that go see the Red Rocks on a regular basis.

[MDUte]

Red Rocks don’t break even. Only Football and MBB do. And MBB barely turns a profit less than $2M/year.

Even filling the Hunty for Gymnastics, the Red Rocks only generate $560K/year in ticket sales revenue. They do amazingly well for women’s gymnastics in terms of covering a big chunk of their $2.9M of annual operating expenses. But all in all, they still end up losing more than $1M/year. Football covers the entire athletic department except for MBB.

[The Miami Ute]

What about concessions? I always thought that the Red Rocks where like a gas station. Essentially that the product was what brings people in but the money was made through the sale of concessions.

[Charlie]

Not sure. I had a friend that owned a station on the side and he always laughed at that thought that is repeated a lot. However, event concessions have a very high profit margin but comes in after TV and ticket sales, I think.

[The Miami Ute]

I don’t know Charlie. I only pay $35 for each of my season tickets and I easily spend that much in concessions every meet I take my daughter to.

[Charlie]

Awesome, I want to sit with you. Kids have quite an impact on concessions, I don’t bother to stop unless I have my grandkids.

[MDUte]

No, either 1) all concessions sales at gymnastics are too small to be recorded or 2) the athletics department doesn’t get to keep any concessions revenue from gymnastics or 3) the small amount recorded gets grouped into the total football concessions sold.

The athletic department only gets a total of $630K from concessions revenue for the entire year. And football accounts for $616K of that figure. So maybe a chunk of that total amount is from MBB, WBB, and Gymnastics or maybe Huntsman Center concessions revenue doesn’t get credited to athletics. But even if it is, it would be a small amount given how little revenue ($630K) athletics gets all year from concessions which football games would drive the bulk of from 54k fans in attendance.The P&L Statements are available online if you want to take a closer look. FY22 Utah Athletics Revenues and Expenses

[ORute]

The impact of the Redrocks goes well beyond their direct P/L. It brings tons of exposure across a range of platforms. You’re also bringing in a market that MBB and FB typically doesn’t; women and kids. This obviously creates a wider ripple effect than direct ticket or concession sales. You develop a new fanbase that can connect with the University in something other than the traditional sports. This creates a lifetime value, but also things like gear sales outside campus, interest in other university sports, events and so on. I think its very smart to keep these tickets low and make it a family fun event. Its something very few other schools can do and we’re lucky to have. I think their impact on the Athletic Dept and general University is a lot larger than can be directly quantified.

[UtahPilot47]

I would not put this issue on the Jazz. There was no problem in the late 90’s when there were fewer people in SLC, the Jazz were competing for a title and so were the Utes. Full houses everywhere.

[HoosierUte]

tuned into some of the other NIT games, utah crowd looked decent compared to others.

[Charlie]

Sadly, 80% of the NIT teams are p**sed they did not make the NCAA tournament. Oddly, I watched college basketball for decades before the NCAA tournament surpassed the NIT and picked first. Maybe the only single significant accomplishment by the NCAA was eclipsing the NIT. Fun fact, when Utah won the national championship in 1944, they went to the NIT tournament and lost. Then the NCAA tournament asked them to fill in for a team that had some kind of tragedy. Utah went on to win the NCAA tournament (which obviously was not enough). However, in those years the two champs played a game after the two tournaments and the Utes beat the Jonnies to take it all. And no, I did not watch the game…

[The Miami Ute]

The NIT used to be “the” tournament just like, at one time, baseball and boxing used to be the most popular sports in the USA. Since you broached the subject of “fun facts”, did you know that one team that used to be a basketball powerhouse once won the NIT and NCAA tournament in the same season? CCNY in 1950.

[Hahnenwk]

Go beavers

[AZUTE]

A Tuesday night with a late start when everyone has work or school the next day against a team nobody knows about. They are lucky they got the 3k they did.

I’d expect the Sunday game vs a name opponent will have much better attendance. It’s also the last home game of the season and Brn Carlson’s last home game of his career barring a major upset and Villanova loses to VCU tonight.

[The Miami Ute]

Is that the bracket? If both VCU and Utah win, then Utah will host another game?

[NarfUte]

If Utah beats Iowa and Villanova loses to VCU or South Florida, we’d host another game